00:04
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I chose Lorentzen's View towards Drammen, Norway.

00:10
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
This painting really spoke to me because of Lorentzen's really masterful composition, nuanced use of light, and very detailed execution. And it just makes a really beautiful work of art where he offers this aesthetic pleasure and he directs the viewer's eye through the serene beauty of this landscape. And it has just a very poetic and romantic quality that I really adore.

00:32
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I'm a very visual director and always have been. I'm super particular about composition and lighting. I'm also prepping a feature that's shooting partly in the Norwegian countryside, something I've always loved to travel in. So I'm drawn to that right now, looking at options for shooting.

00:50
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
This quiet, almost meditative mood of the painting expresses my own longing for peace and reflection in nature. It inspires me to enjoy life.

01:07
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
My name is Tina Jøhnk Christensen, and I'm the host of Danish Originals, a podcast series created in partnership with the American Friends of the National Gallery of Denmark and the National Gallery of Denmark. Our goal is to celebrate Danish creatives who have made a significant mark in the US.

01:25
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Today, our guest is Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg, a Danish director and actress too. Welcome, Barbara.

01:33
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Thank you.

01:35
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
It's very lovely having you with us. You were only 21 when you moved to Los Angeles. You were by yourself in a completely new world. What was the first week in the city like? It can feel pretty huge and overwhelming in the beginning. How did you get settled and where did you get settled?

01:54
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Well, I actually didn't know a single person, so it was super exciting. I had been set up with a friend of a friend of a friend of someone who knew someone who was subletting. So I had a place and then he actually ended up having his trip postponed a little bit. So he was there for the first few days and he took me to a big pool party on the first night.

02:17
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So yeah, being 21 and being taken to a pool party in the Hills with lots of industry people, it was definitely a welcome to Hollywood in all senses of the word with girls in bikinis and a lot of Hollywood producers in suits looking at the view and the girls in the bikinis and talking shop. So yeah, that was a very funny study for me, the first night, experiencing this.

02:41
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
And where in the city was that? Where did you settle down?

02:44
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
West Hollywood, in the beginning, close by Melrose, the first couple of years. And I really loved that because I didn't have a car, I didn't have a driver's license in the beginning. So I walked and biked around and of course everybody thought I was crazy. And it was tough since when you had to buy milk, it was like a gallon. So it was really heavy and it was so far away.

03:05
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
But you know, I was biking around and loving that you could actually walk to places on Melrose. So that kind of life. And meeting so many people from all over the world and of course, tons of Americans, was super inspiring to me right off the bat.

03:22
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I think I had always had the personality, kind of, of an American, being super open and inviting. So in that way I really fit in, which was great. And of course, with the years, I also learned that there was a lot of shallowness in that. But in the beginning, being 21 and being there, I loved how open people were and welcoming.

03:45
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
LA is a huge city. It's very vast. The public transportation is awful. And when you talk about biking around LA, I get nervous on your behalf, because it's not a city where the people who drive are used to bikes. So how did you get your driving license? Did you end up getting it here?

04:03
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I got it in LA after about nine months, I think, when I ended up staying in LA. I didn't know I was going to stay, but I fell in love with it, of course, the sunshine and everything. So yeah, I think it cost me $23 compared to Denmark, which was insane. And it was basically because people thought I was crazy.

04:22
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
The first film I was working on as a PA, the line producer threw my bike in the back of her Jeep to drive me home because she did think that it was really dangerous biking around, especially since there were no lights on it either. So yeah, it was super easy in the States, at least back then you didn't have to take lessons or anything. You could have a friend teach you. So $23 later, I had the driver's license and then I bought a really cheap, really terrible car and was driving around without AC. Really hot in LA, as you know.

04:55
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I learned how to get around and everything. But back then it was with what we called a Thomas Guide. So that was a big, thick map book. So once I had to go on different sets in the desert and all different kinds of places around LA and far out of LA, it was crazy driving at 5 AM trying to find your way and looking at the same time in the map book. So yeah, crazy fun times.

05:21
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
What was your first car?

05:24
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
My first car was— I think it was a Nissan, but it was really old. And very rusty, but I didn't care. But my second car! My second car was a convertible, and I still miss that thing. It was a Mitsubishi, so nothing fancy, but the fact that it was a convertible, so driving with your hair floating in the air and loud music, I felt like a million bucks, no matter how poor I was.

05:48
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
I know, you have to have a convertible in LA. I have one too.

05:52
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Oh yeah.

05:53
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
It's just the most fantastic thing, driving in an open car in the city.

05:58
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Hell yeah. And even if it's cold, you just put on the heat a little bit and yeah, it's awesome.

06:02
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
What made you want to move to Los Angeles? And how did you realize your goal of actually staying in the US?

06:11
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I was a child actress back in Denmark since I was very young. And growing up, having that kind of identity, as people would recognize me from basically seven years old. It was my own fault because I continued to do movies all through my teens as well. And I was a host on a TV show, and finally something called "Barbara's Galaxy."

06:31
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So people recognized me and it had a big impact on my life, also in a negative way, where I was always very conscious. I was never a fun, wild teenager. I was always way too careful how to act and behave. And I think I needed, subconsciously, I needed to get away from that identity.

06:51
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I also knew I was starting to make really bad short films in my middle and late teens. And I knew that I wanted to direct. But being an actress, and I luckily loved the shows that I did, I was worried that people would give me an advantage, like getting into the Danish Film School or stuff like that. I really needed to get away, and be left on my own to figure out if I even had talent in directing myself without other people looking over my shoulders and deciding for me.

07:24
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
That and then I also had a mentally ill father and a very, not dominant, but very demanding mother. So I think there was a combination of things that wanted me to escape, but it was also an escape into the dream of Hollywood. But again, I didn't know I was going to stay that long. I just knew that I loved it.

07:50
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
How did you manage it? I mean, visas and stuff. We all went through it when we first arrived, how to get permission to stay here. Was that easy for you?

08:00
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
It definitely wasn't easy. It was a lawyer and lots of press and lots of— I think it was called O-1 or something. It definitely took a few years to even get permission, but I was really lucky. I got jobs.

08:13
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think I was working in a restaurant for only a week, I think, and then there was a producer who came to the restaurant, always to have lunch. And again, Americans and all, you'd start chatting and, Oh, I'm trying to be a director, and I did these shorts. And he's like, Oh, bring them to me, and let's see if you have any talent. And then he was like, okay, you can have a job as a PA on my film.

08:34
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I got started like that. And then I was lucky enough that everybody on this film was totally useless. So in five weeks, I think I was promoted seven times or something crazy. And I was all different kinds of things. It was a low budget film, but it was really fun and really challenging to try lots of different positions on a film.

08:52
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I ended up on set being a 1st AD and actually maybe using my old acting talents, I actually knew how to behave at least as if I knew what I was doing and run a set. And so from there on, people took me to another job and another job, and that made it easier in all different kinds of ways to stay in Los Angeles.

09:12
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
You fell right into a party. Now you tell me that you meet a producer at a restaurant within a week. That's quite lucky. But how were the first years then? Did it continue to be a smooth ride or were there any difficulties?

09:26
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think I would say it was a smooth ride. I was very fortunate and I've always said, at least until recently, that I was born under a lucky star because things have often come easily to me. I think other people, when I say that out loud, are like, yeah, but you're also super hardworking and you never give up. And that's probably true as well.

09:49
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
But I also, again, I think I just have an energy that is I'm trustworthy, maybe. And again, this first job was just a PA, but when you are eager to learn and are also humble, because so many people in LA, especially in the beginning, I felt, were behaving like they knew everything. And you found out they didn't know anything.

10:12
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Ego was one of the things, honestly, I got tired of in Los Angeles after 11 years there. And of course we have the little bit opposite in Denmark, which can also be tiring with the Jante Law. So I think I'm kind of a mix of those two.

10:27
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I started working in the industry from almost the beginning and one job led to another and to another. I took different courses in writing, so I wrote a lot of scripts on the side, being a 1st AD, and on bigger films, I was a Key Set PA. That was my education, being on different types of movies, learning what to do and what not to do as well, for sure.

10:52
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And it was a lot of really terrible low budget horror movies with zombies in the desert. But I met some really amazing people and some who are still my friends today, who are below the line crew people. And that was a great learning experience for me doing all sorts of different movies.

11:12
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Maybe explain to people who don't know what "below the line" means.

11:16
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Sure. Well, below the line is the crew, the casting directors, the makeup artists, the costume designers, all the people who are not director, producers, or actors.

11:28
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
So people think of Hollywood and they imagine this glamorous life where the sky is the limit and there's this great lifestyle, sunny lifestyle here. What was it like for you? What was your experience of the film business in Los Angeles?

11:47
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think to me, it seemed there was a lot of hustling and people had what we call in Denmark, very sharp elbows. For a long time, I was really content and very happy being lucky enough to work in the industry and learning like that. On the side, I was directing a lot of shorts, writing scripts. As a writer, I was sometimes getting people to option, people to buy.

12:12
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I couldn't get any films to direct myself, but I never expected that. When I got my first offer to direct a feature eight, nine years later or something, I was shocked that I had earned that by doing all these shorts. But I think seeing people wanting the dream, the Hollywood dream so badly and not behaving well towards others, I never wanted that. And I think I'd never aspired to be Spielberg or making it as a big director there.

12:46
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Honestly I was just so happy that I was living the dream and educating myself. And when you also have friends who take you to Oscar screenings, where your heroes are there, you see a movie and the cast and crew and the director are there talking about their piece and you're learning from them. To me, that was the best film school ever. So I was super happy and honored that I was allowed to be in this world for such a long time.

13:17
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
11 years in Los Angeles is a long time. There must've been ups and downs. What were the ups and downs for you? The low and the high.

13:26
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think that the downside, honestly, women, friends that I found out were shallow, were superficial, that when it really mattered, they were not there for you. And I was used to, from Denmark, your friends really being there through thick and thin. So that was the toughest for me for sure.

13:49
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I think the ups again were all these amazing friends I got, people from all over the world. I think for me, that's one thing I miss the most, having lived here now for a long time, is meeting and being inspired by people from all over the world because Los Angeles is so crazy with people from everywhere and their stories and their backstories so you are always inspired. There's always more stories.

14:16
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
In Denmark, we all come from the same culture, background, almost the same environment. That was definitely a high and something I miss a lot.

14:27
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
You also did make a feature film here, right? Love at First Hiccup. It came out in 2009 and it featured a very young Nicholas Brown that we now know from Succession and Saturday Night, a movie that he's currently in. Ray Wise from David Lynch's Twin Peaks was also in it. How involved were you in hiring the actors for this? Did you have a say or was it mainly your casting director deciding on the talent?

14:58
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Oh, no, that was 100% me. I thought that was natural that it was always the director, but of course it was a close collaboration. But yeah, I'd always loved Ray Wise. We didn't know Nicholas or any of the other youngsters, so that was an open casting. And that was amazing in Los Angeles.

15:17
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And that's hard here, honestly, and was, especially in the beginning when I moved here, that there are so many amazing actors to choose from in Los Angeles or in America in general. And kid actors, young actors, they're trained and they want it so early that they really practice and go to a tutor from an early age.

15:38
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Coming back here, I remember I had to do a TV series called Sjit Happens, that actually went on to be quite big here, but I couldn't find any good actors. I wanted to do a Friends kind of a show — everybody classically trained in drama, super talented when it came to comedic timing. We couldn't find anybody who was funny. There was so few people to choose from.

16:00
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So I ended up having to use two standup comedians, which was so against my belief because I wanted people to act act. Where again, in Los Angeles, there's sessions for everything, 30-minute comedy, whatever the timing is. And I can definitely say that I miss the amount of talent that there is in the States.

16:21
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
How was auditioning? Try to explain to a listener who's never heard of the word audition. You have to go through quite a lot of talent before you pick someone, right?

16:31
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
You have to go through a lot of talent because there's so many amazing ones to choose from, I would say. But, you know, a scary instance is when we had to cast a small part for that movie, which was a beautiful young blonde, kind of a bimbo.

16:44
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And the waiting room when I arrived was, I think 50, one more beautiful than the next. And then once we got in the room, more talented than the next, really rooted in pure raw, real talent. And I was shocked how many you had to choose from.

17:05
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And of course, I also have friends now who have been in the game for many, many years who are so talented, and friends of them end up Oscar-nominated, but they don't get anywhere. So that's the downside of the business over there, is there's nothing fair. It's random and who you know at the right time.

17:25
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
And talk about being the director on a movie on this scale. You are in charge of not only the actors, but also all the people below the line, you're sort of the person who's holding all the strings together. People don't imagine that a director is actually having a lot of elements to think of while shooting a movie.

17:46
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think because I had the training as a 1st AD where basically you take charge of everything below the director, but almost more because you have to have 12 balls in the air at the same time and think a lot ahead. And I think for me, that has really been the best education because now I have those skills.

18:04
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I'm also maybe a little too responsible towards the production, meaning that I'm very conscious of not going over time or over budget. And I really want to make everybody happy at the same time. On my first film, Love at First Hiccup, it was really crazy having, I think, 18 huge trucks and 140 people. And having that be my movie, that was a crazy high that I so valued. And it was so fun. It was just so fun.

18:36
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And luckily it ended up being a good movie too. But I think there's so many directors because there's so much responsibility on their first film, they crash and burn because it's just so terrifying having all these people rely on you and so many millions of dollars or crowns that are relying on you behaving and doing a really great job and being completely prepared for everything. It was a high for me, for sure.

19:01
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Where did you shoot the film?

19:03
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
It was throughout Los Angeles.

19:05
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
You were lucky to get to shoot here.

19:06
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Yeah. Very lucky. I know. I know.

19:10
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Are there any sort of fond memories, special anecdotes from, from shooting this film that make you smile?

19:17
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I just showed my kids, I have a five- and seven-year old, and I just showed them pictures of me with a huge tarantula on my head, because it's a remake of a Danish film, and we had to have this big tarantula that's crawling around the set. And it got loose, and of course, over there, there were animal wranglers, and it was completely harmless, they said.

19:37
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So I had it in my hand and I had it on my head and it was just fun. But I think the cast were really sweet and we had this kind of feeling of being a family and making something that would make people smile and laugh. And that definitely gave us all just a really great sense of going to work. All in all, that was just, that was an amazing ride.

19:58
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
That's a description that you get a lot from people who are on film crews, that it's like one big family, and then you move on to a next family and then another one. Do you stay in touch with all these old family members that you've created on sets?

20:14
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think it's impossible to stay close with everybody, but I definitely try to stay in touch with as many as I can. And I must admit, it's the biggest high. A few months ago, I got an email from someone who had found me. I had given him his first job in the business, and now he's a big time producer and stuff.

20:33
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
He was like, I just want to tell you, thank you for giving me such a great experience, making me want to be in this business, because there are so many assholes. And of course that's an amazing feeling. So even though I hadn't stayed in touch with him, he actually found me.

20:47
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Why did you decide to leave Los Angeles and move back to Denmark and what was the move like? Did you have to get used to Danish culture again or was it an easy move?

20:59
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
It was a really tough choice, because again, being there for 11 years and it was all through my 20s. I had my best friends there. I felt like I had my life there. I'd become more and more American. And of course also having so many roots in the industry. So I was back and forth for about two, three years.

21:21
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And slowly, I had a film going in Denmark and I gave up my apartment and put my things in storage. And then a year later, I came back and took the things out of storage and had them shipped to Denmark. It was tough making that decision.

21:33
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Mainly, I turned 31 or 32. I knew that I wanted a family. I wanted kids. And to me, the culture in Los Angeles, being a female director, was not how I wanted to have a family, have kids. Because what I observed, at least, was that it was all nannies and au pairs raising these kids and you work 16 to 18 hours a day.

22:05
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And in Denmark, it just seemed that there was a much better balance, much healthier balance, which I found to be true. You can actually have a life. And also a career and that's the hugest luxury, of course, but it was hard coming back home. Also culturally, again, people are a lot more closed off. I was told by I don't know how many big producers in Denmark, 'cause I just called people up and said, hello, my name is Barbara. Can we have coffee?

22:35
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And people were kind enough to say yes, but once at the coffee, people were shutting me out, saying, listen, there's no room for more directors. You're not educated from the Danish Film School, forget about it. So it was definitely tough. I for sure had to start over from scratch.

22:53
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I worked for a long time for free, also on Sjit Happens to get that going, and they ran out of money. And so you had to pay your dues all over again. But I think I've never been afraid to pull up my sleeves. I was mainly afraid that people would see me and maybe I still am—

23:10
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
You introduced me as an actress. I haven't been an actress for 20 something years. But that people would see me as just an actress, an uneducated ex-actress who thinks she can direct. That has taken and probably are still in the process of hopefully convincing people that I actually know a little bit about what I'm doing.

23:29
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
I was going to ask you a little bit about that, because you were very well-known in Denmark from a very young age. You were in a TV show called Nana, and you were a young actress back then. It was a huge success in the '80s.

23:43
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Well, we only had one channel, right? So people didn't have a choice.

23:47
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Everybody watched it. Everybody was watching it. Is it hard to deal when you are young to become famous? And as you said, is it hard to break free of that?

24:00
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think for sure, as we've seen a lot of child actors here and in the States, crash and burn and go on drugs or become self-absorbed narcissists. I think what kept me on the ground, since I did continue to do movies, was that I had a mother who knew how to talk to me about it. She was an actress.

24:21
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And then I had a dad who was mentally ill, so I had some big issues in my life to deal with. And of course I was sad about that. That was really hard. But I think that's basically what grounded me and I knew what real life was, it wasn't just red carpets and everything.

24:39
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I do think in Denmark, it is refreshing when you come home from Hollywood, that the biggest stars bike to the gala premieres in their dresses, and I've always loved that. So we're very unpretentious in that way in Denmark and even the biggest stars, you can go up to them on the street or call them up on the phone and say, hello. And yeah, that's definitely admirable about Denmark.

25:04
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
There are not nearly as many female directors as there are male. And even though there seems to be a better balance in Denmark, do you feel that you have a responsibility to tell female stories? One of your films is about pregnancy, actually a comedy about baby swapping, for instance, and another film is about mature women's friendships in a food club.

25:28
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
In Los Angeles, there were, I want to say no female directors. Of course, there were some, but in those days, 20 some years ago, there were almost none. Coming home, and as you said, there are some, more and more. But way too few still. And yeah, I think we all have a responsibility to get those stories out.

25:50
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Now, I have two boys, but my friends who have daughters, what stories have they, and have we as kids, mirrored ourselves in? It's been boys' stories growing up and I think that's dangerous for sure. I think we all have a big responsibility in mirroring everything.

26:10
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
For me, having done movies about pregnancies, and I have another movie coming out on Netflix very soon that's about being a parent, basically, a mother in today's society, making that all work, work-life balance. Those have been personal stories to me. I think most of my films, since I started directing films and having a little more say in what I wanted to make, what stories I wanted to tell, you're definitely right, they've had a female angle, but also a personal angle.

26:41
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Food Club is a movie about women in their 60s who create a food club. Usually this age group is not represented that well in movies. Were the producers worried that there would be an audience for it? I heard, for instance, from the director of Thelma with June Squibb, who's in her 90s, that that was a big worry for the studio and for the producers. Would anybody watch a 94-year old woman as the lead in a movie?

27:10
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Yeah, I think I was very much in love with Jason Reitman films, and Sideways, if you know that one.

27:17
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Of course.

27:18
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I think having these complicated and not very likable characters was super interesting to me. Seeing my mother getting older and having society not treating her as being relevant, basically, I think, was very interesting to me, how we see especially women getting older.

27:40
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So I think it was a combination of those things that made it really important to me to have those stories told, just like I said, with kids. That audience, also, deserved to be seen and be portrayed in films. And there have been great Nancy Meyers films in the States. And of course we could watch those here and everywhere else.

28:01
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I felt like the Danish audience also deserved to have those stories be reflected from society. And to me, that's a friendship story as well about three women, which was also very rare, no matter what the age in Denmark, there's not been that many friendship films with three women.

28:20
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
The women go on a trip to Puglia in Italy. Marie, Berling and Vanja, and they're all dealing with each other's problems that come with being at that age. You dedicated the movie to your mother, Judith, and she's in it too. She plays a rather colorful lady who likes gnomes in her garden. Why was it important to you to make this movie, and why dedicate it to your mother?

28:49
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Well, like I said before, I feel we didn't really take it seriously what her age group was going through, and not being seen. So to me, it was being very close to my mom and hearing her issues and worrying for all of us women, how it feels to be irrelevant once you hit, I don't even know, some people say even 55. I don't know. It's terrible.

29:18
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So I think for me that was why it was important. And in honor of my mom and her friendships. She had a group of friends that inspired me a lot to do this. They would go on trips and they would be there for each other and they would be each other's soulmates. Men would come and go, but they would be each other's everything.

29:39
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And of course that would, like in long relationships, also come with lots of issues. To me, that was just so much, so much potential in these stories. And we also developed a sequel to this film, which they just shot. I passed on it, but they just did a Food Club 2. So that's great.

29:57
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Fantastic. Your film Loving Adults, which is based on a romantic psycho drama of the same name, a novel published in 2017, is the first ever Danish language feature made for Netflix. How did you get this deal and how was the experience for you making a Danish film for Netflix?

30:21
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I was working with the producer Marcella Dichmann on Maybe Baby, which was a very personal project to me. She had just seen Food Club and she developed this film for a little while. And apparently she just really felt I had that combination of American aesthetics and European sensibility.

30:43
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And that's what Netflix, I think, was looking for in terms of this film, which had potential to be extremely rooted in a Danish story, but still have this universal subject matter of hatred and love being so close together, between husband and wife.

31:01
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So, she asked me if I was interested in it. And I had done some really dark short films, really dark, but as a person, was very happy-go-lucky, and a lot of the features I had done, very-feel good. So I was really honored that she trusted and Netflix trusted that I could actually do this film.

31:21
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And it was an amazing pleasure to do it because the actors were fantastic to work with. It was such a fun and terrible subject matter. And Netflix were just amazing to work with because they were so respectful. In all our note meetings, they were constantly saying, we think this and this, but hey, it's your movie.

31:44
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And you don't have final cut most of the time, I think, when you're working with streamers. And it didn't matter at all because they were just so respectful and yeah, it was really a delight working with them.

31:57
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Now that you've had both experiences, what's the difference between making a movie in the US and making one in Denmark?

32:06
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
The size of the crew is definitely a huge difference. I think for most, now it wasn't my experience because it wasn't a studio film, but most of my friends have done studio films. They are so managed over there, where in Denmark we are still what they would call artists. I don't consider myself an artist, but we're so respected for being craftsmen.

32:33
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I think there's just so much respect around that. So, we basically get to do what we want because it's our vision and our work. So that for me was the biggest difference, knowing that you have final say and also responsibility in making it your signature film.

32:54
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And what a lot of people have told me is that no matter if it's a comedy or something dark, my films have this combination of sensibilities since I've been so long in the States and still are very Danish in my roots.

33:07
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
What do you feel that you brought along from the United States to Denmark, experiences that you can utilize in your career in Denmark?

33:18
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think I'm super visual. I'm very influenced by David Fincher. And I'm, at least I'm told from people I work closely with, that it's rare for someone to be that involved in the visuals as a director. Of course I always work with amazing DPs and it's a great collaboration and everything, but I definitely meddle a lot.

33:40
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And then also I remember in the beginning, when I started working here, I was very much into all the department heads, the person who was in charge of costume and the person who was a production designer and the DP and me having a lot of meetings where we make sure that everything goes well together.

34:00
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
That was something they didn't do a lot here. I think they've started a little bit more. But that was super important to me that aesthetically, color combinations and everything in every single detail of the actors' costumes, they meshed well. That's one thing I've always cared a lot about as well. And what else? Probably working with the actors is a more Danish way, I would think.

34:28
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
How would you describe that?

34:28
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think probably mainly because I was an actress and the moment I decided that I wanted to direct was when I was on a film and there was such a terrible, terrible director who basically knew nothing, didn't care, and was all about ego, and didn't listen to me or any of the other actors on what they could bring or what they wanted to try.

35:00
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So for me it's always been so important, that of course I have a way of thinking that I envision the scene, but it's a collaboration in all senses of the word. And casting is everything, as they say. And if you don't trust who you've hired, then why bother? They are the instruments that we're lucky enough to play.

35:20
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
You mentioned before that there were not that many female directors at the time when you were here. Who are your role models? If you think about female directors now, there are a few more in the States now, there are a few more internationally than 20 years ago.

35:38
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I very much respect Susanne Bier's career. Her earliest work, especially with Anders Thomas Jensen, writing her fantastic scripts. And even now later working with Netflix, she's very diverse. And I admire that. And I think, again, just like I feel lucky that I've been allowed to work on such different genres. I feel like she definitely knows her craft very well.

36:06
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
In terms of feel-good entertainment in the States, I've always really admired Nancy Meyers. She has a great way of making very commercial, very broad films that are really heartfelt, and at least have always captured my heart in terms of using amazing actors to tell sometimes rather superficial films, but in a very deep and profound way. So I respect her a lot.

36:34
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
You mentioned before that after 11 years in LA, you started feeling American. What would you say is the American part of you?

36:45
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
As a person or a director?

36:47
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
Both!

36:49
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think being so open is definitely an American part of me, but it's been there before I moved to the States. So it's a personality thing. Having been there, I think that it was probably both a blessing and a curse, but I learned more and more to navigate the system over there, meaning every party you were at, people were networking, people were showing each other their scripts, or name-dropping or talking to actors to get them in their movies.

37:20
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Because that's the way you get things done. And I got better at that, but I also loathed it. I really loathed it. And I wanted to have a life where I had all different types of people in my surroundings. So I also thought about other things than movies. Because in Los Angeles, it seemed everybody was in entertainment some way or another.

37:44
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And I longed to have an architect as a friend who would enlighten me in other ways of the world and have a doctor who talked about saving lives. It definitely seemed we cared too much just about our own little entertainment world and not the actual world over there. The Hollywood bubble, yeah.

38:05
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
You've been in Denmark for quite a while. What do you think are the pluses of being an expat?

38:09
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think, for sure, not being afraid to sell myself and actually believing that I did have some talent, that was something America or Hollywood definitely taught me. And that was a great skill coming here, because people are in a good way, very humble, but like I said, also very Jante Law-struck.

38:32
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
So they seem to be a little too humble for my opinion. Most of them never learning how to sell themselves or knowing how to navigate in their own skillset. And that's something I feel very fortunate that I came to learn just by being a person living there.

38:55
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
And my final question to you. If you were told you had one more thing that you could do before you retire —

39:04
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
I think I have maybe four or five really important projects that I'm developing right now because to get things done is having a lot of things and then you see which one happens first.

39:16
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
There's an Anne Frank film that I find to be very important. That's an English language, Spielberg-inspired action adventure film that deals with everything the world is going through today mixed with the Holocaust. That's super important to me because of everything that's going on.

39:35
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And then I have some more personal projects where women dealing with a gaslighting husband is a big issue. And that's something I've personally experienced in a way myself. And I know lots of other people have experienced, and that's damaging for life. Yeah, that's two.

39:55
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
And then I have a youth film that I find to be super important that deals with hurtcore. That's a very terrible subject matter, about especially young women being targeted online and forced to self-harm, something way too few people know about and is brought out even in Denmark. So, yeah. Oh, yeah, and then a few others.

40:16
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
But I think my first priority is for sure my kids and being with them. And that's why I find myself to be so fortunate living in Denmark and being able to live my dream working as a director and then also having a family and most of the time coming home to dinner even though I'm shooting.

40:33
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
That's really fantastic. And showing them the world now is definitely a big passion of mine. So if I have to choose one thing, it'll have to be traveling with my kids, even over movies.

40:47
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
All right. Thank you so much for your time, Barbara. We really appreciate you being part of Danish Originals.

40:53
Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg
Thank you.

40:58
Tina Jøhnk Christensen
For today's episode, Barbara Topsøe-Rothenborg chose C.A. Lorentzen's Udsigt over Drammen i Norge, or View Towards Drammen, Norway from 1790–1799 from the collection of the National Gallery of Denmark.